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Post by p0c on Mar 1, 2006 2:08:45 GMT -5
Jim and I were talking about this idea last night. If we can find ways to set this up, would you be interested in a ladder similar to Mota Inhouse League? Anyone who is registered for the league could play, unlike MIHL. We can set up scoring and stuff, write up some rules, and get this started. I think it'll be really fun ;D
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Post by p0c on Mar 1, 2006 2:29:47 GMT -5
I'm thinking of renaming it Individual Dota Ladder instead.... you know, pride issue and all
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Post by shaang on Mar 1, 2006 2:50:20 GMT -5
Azeroth DotA League!
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Post by p0c on Mar 1, 2006 4:05:15 GMT -5
me and shaang discussed this a little and we came up with this framework for the league... we'll pretty much borrow mota's idea except it will be on a register basis instead of clan members only. players may only join through an invite through someone who is already in the league. we can start off with our regular inhouse circle... ada, col, l3cr, who, wac, aota, whoever. people who are on our friends lists who are good enough not to feed and ruin games. if we dont have enough people, for the first week of this league, people can invite whoever they want, as long as its within reason. then after that, each person will only be allowed to invite 1 person into the league. new recruits will only be allowed to invite people after they have joined for a month. eventually we'll have to cut off invitations all together, if all goes well. if we need moderators for the league, we can let well known clans' chieftains act as moderators, though it might be a pain explaining everything to them. we'll work it out. destructive members will be dealt with on a conduct point basis. if someone is acting out of line in a game, players can take a screenshot and post the details on the forum, and let moderators review it. they will be punished with a conduct point, and if you get too many you will be booted from the league (maybe for just one cycle, unless youre a chronic offender or if nobody likes you). conduct points will also decrease their score... scoring will be similar to mota's scoring system. +100 pts for a win (same for ar and ap to keep it simple) -50 pts for a loss +2 pts for a kill -1 pt for a death +10 pts for 15 or more kills in one game -10 pts for no kills in one game -10 pts for 15 or more deaths in one game +10 pts for no deaths in one game these numbers can be tweaked as needed. as for the technical side of this league: games can be started any time there are enough people on. minimum number of players is 8. mota uses a bot command to choose captains but i dont think it really matters. captains could be hand picked or if all else fails just use the roll command. whatever. the game is played with cal rules and a game can be forfeited any time after 30 minutes if the majority of players on a team forfeit. leaving a game or going AFK for more than 10 minutes without the consent of your team will result in a conduct point. disconnecting from a game will result in -50 pts as well as points accumulated from your score during the game, but no +100 pts for victory or -50 pts for loss. after the game is done, someone from the winning team will take a screenshot of the final scores and post it on www.imageshack.us/. (its a free website and you dont even need to register to post a picture.) then he can post a thread about it in the form of "5v5 AP a_little_rabbit over inde_ed", whoever the captains were. then ill take care of the rest using infinite patience and microsoft excel. scores can be updated daily if im not lazy. ill have to figure out how to use excel first though. yeah thats about all i can think of for now. consider this a reliable inhouse system with incentives to play your best. now the hard part is getting it started and having people take interest and take this seriously. dont start telling people yet, or at least dont broadcast it. maybe we can get this up by next week and unveil it in an inhouse... feel free to make suggestions! |
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Post by fang on Mar 1, 2006 12:14:58 GMT -5
I think the point system needs to be tweaked. I think the points for win and points for loss are too much compared to the points you get for kills/deaths. Someone who went 14-1 in a game but lost would get -50 + 2*14 - 1 = -23 points. Whereas someone who went 1-14 and won the game would get 100 + 2 - 14 = 88 points. WOW?!?!?
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Post by dominionwing on Mar 1, 2006 12:47:10 GMT -5
why not use our apex forum as a base for the league. have a section where they can send in screenshots. I think it would be nice if we designate the host to always submit the screenshot, and then have 1 or 2 forum moderators for scoring do the actual scoring. have the host put at the bottom of the screenshot other scoring factors that should be taken in to consideration like disconnecting and stuff. (if possible maybe the host can even do the scoring himself with the SS)
also i think we should make it so that really good games that are 90+, the loser dont lose 50 points. Of course these other rules and setups could be discussed as the plan moves on.
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Post by dominionwing on Mar 1, 2006 12:52:36 GMT -5
as for the scoring system i agree with fang that the kill/death scores needs to be upped. maybe to 4 a kill 2 a death. this way if your teamlost and u went 10-0. it would be 4*10 +10(for haveing 10 kills) and give u 50, that cancels out the loss and u end with 0. while the other team who have a 0-10, would get -30 and oonly get 70 points for sacrificing himself and but still winning the game.
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Post by p0c on Mar 1, 2006 14:56:30 GMT -5
how about...
+50 pts for a win (same for all modes to keep it simple)
-40 pts for a loss
+2 pts for a kill
-1 pt for a death
+10 pts for 15 or more kills in one game
-10 pts for 15 or more deaths in one game
+5 pts for no deaths in one game
-5 pts for no kills in one game
And yeah I was thinking of using these forums for the league. I can easily set up a seperate subcategory for the league with a general discussion, players forum (for disputes, invites, etc), scores forum, and whatever else is needed. it would just appear under the 3 apex forums that are up right now.
I dont think scores should be changed if it lasts longer than 90 minutes. First of all, this would mean more work for the scorekeepers. And second, this would encourage losing teams to drag games out instead of just forfeiting if they are clearly losing. Seems like a waste of time to me. Good, close games should be a reward in themselves, anyway. You shouldn't have to encourage it through the scoring system.
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Post by themuff1nman on Mar 1, 2006 15:11:01 GMT -5
I like the idea a lot, but I think a 150 point gap between winning and losing is much too large. A system like this would benefit those who played more rather than those who played better.
Ex:
Player 1: (only taking into account team wins/losses)
20 wins / 3 losses = 1850 points (87% win rate)
Player 2:
30 wins / 23 losses = 1850 points (56.6% win rate)
It seems apparent that the first player is better, yet he earns the same amount of points as the second player.
I also agree with Fang and Jim on the changing the individual kill/death point values. Because it is an "individual league", kills should be more rewarding and deaths more detrimental to one's score (although this will create more incentive to ks, but as long as everyone realizes ks'ing will be prevalent in the league, this shouldn't be too big of a problem.)
-Muffins
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Post by dominionwing on Mar 1, 2006 20:01:25 GMT -5
i like the +5o for win and -40 for loss.that would mean a person on the losing team with 15-0 score would actually get +5, and a person on the winning team with a score of 0-15 would get +5 also.
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Post by shaang on Mar 1, 2006 20:12:33 GMT -5
I used Excel extensively for my AP STATS project, I might be interested in scorekeeping/etc. By the way, why isn't it 50/25? I think 50/40 still hugely favors the outcome of the game. I mean this is supposed to focus on individual ranks, and I think 50/25 would be better and consistent.
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Post by themuff1nman on Mar 1, 2006 20:30:46 GMT -5
i agree
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Post by fang on Mar 1, 2006 20:41:54 GMT -5
Keep in mind that it would be bad for it to get to the point where nobody cares if they win or lose, and only care about their kills.
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Post by p0c on Mar 1, 2006 22:03:03 GMT -5
well if it's 50/-25, then a person with 20 wins and 3 losses would still have the same score as a person with 30 wins and 23 losses like muffins said... and i mean he does have a good point there... we definately dont want the winner to be whoever plays the most.
shaang: i think maybe we should have 2 scorekeepers to have redundancy and minimize mistakes. im willing to keep score too and i could work on the spreadsheet with you.
an issue that could occur in this league is if clans simply played inhouses within their own clan (excluding other clans, or unbeknownst to other clans) and submitted the games. we need to find a way to ensure games are evenly mixed with everyone who wants to play.
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Post by shaang on Mar 2, 2006 22:00:06 GMT -5
Are we still doing this or what, with birth of the IHG provided by Ucross?
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